Oct. 17, 2022

Motivo Health Is Changing The Way Mental Health Professionals Find Clinical Supervision With Rachel McCrickard And Dr. Carla Smith

Motivo Health Is Changing The Way Mental Health Professionals Find Clinical Supervision With Rachel McCrickard And Dr. Carla Smith

Motivo Health Is Changing The Way Mental Health Professionals Find Clinical Supervision With Rachel McCrickard And Dr. Carla Smith

Motivo is a virtual clinical supervision platform for behavioral health employers.

Motivo helps aspiring therapists, social workers, behavior analysts, and psychologists complete and maintain their licensure through virtual clinical supervision and continuing education.


My two guests today are CEO and founder Rachel McCrickard, and Chief Clinical Officer, Dr. Carla Smith.


A few questions we cover in this episode:

  • What is the process of becoming a licensed therapist?
  • Why is finding clinical supervision so difficult?
  • How does Motivo Health make it easier for clinicians to find supervision?
  • What are the barriers for pre-licensed mental health professionals after they graduate?


In areas where clinical supervisors are rare, how can therapists and their clients access quality mental health services? Motivo Health fills in the gaps for mental health professionals.

In this episode of the Mental Health Today Podcast, John welcomes Motivo Health CEO and founder Rachel McCrickard and Chief Clinical Officer Dr. Carla Smith. With both background and expertise in marriage and family therapy, as well as social work, they have witnessed the gaps in the industry and have found ways to address them.

While it may be tough in rural areas to find good clinical supervisors with related expertise and cultural background, Motivo Health makes it easier for their clients.

As a mental health tech company, Motivo Health offers a platform for behavioral health employers such as aspiring therapists, social workers, behavioral analysts, and psychologists to complete and maintain their licensure through virtual means. This includes clinical supervision, continuing education, and a seamless licensure process so therapists receive validation for their expertise – treating people who need help the most.

[Timecodes]

[02:19] What is Motivo Health?
[03:40] Introducing Rachel McCrickard and Dr. Carla Smith
[10:17] What is culturally responsive care?
[12:19] What is the typical process of becoming a licensed therapist?
[16:42] Finding clinical supervision these days is difficult.
[20:10] Motivo is making it easier for people to find clinical supervisors.
[23:22] How can pre-licensed therapists find a good supervisor on Motivo Health?
[24:47] How can supervisors get connected to Motivo Health?
[29:49] Self-care tips

Additional Resources:
Visit Motivo Health’s Official Website: motivohealth.com
Connect with Rachel McCrickard: www.linkedin.com/in/rachelmccrickard
Connect with Dr. Carla Smith: www.linkedin.com/in/drcarlasmith


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Disclaimer: The Mental Health Today Show is for educational purposes only and should not be interpreted as therapy. If you are seeking therapy, please contact a licensed therapist for help.

Transcript

Motivo Health Is Changing The Way Mental Health Professionals Find Clinical Supervision With Rachel McCrickard And Dr. Carla Smith 

[00:00:00] John Cordray: Years ago when I was just starting out as a therapist, one of the things that we have to do to get licensed is to have supervision. And this was a long, long time ago, and I just remember I was so ready for supervision because it takes years to get through graduate class. And then finally supervision when you're actually doing the work and you meet with someone else that's a lot more experienced than you are, and you.

[00:00:28] John Cordray: Learn and live it what you've been studying for so long, and so I cannot wait to introduce you to these two individuals who work for a company that all they do is provide clinical supervision for therapists up and coming therapists, and that's so needed. And there's such a, problem with finding a good supervisor, so I'm really excited about that.

[00:00:53] John Cordray: The title of this episode is Motiva Health is Changing the Way Mental Health Professionals [00:01:00] Find Clinical Supervision with Rachel mcr and Dr. Carla Smith coming right up. 

[00:01:07] John Cordray: Welcome to the Mental Health Today Show. My name is John Cordray and I am a licensed therapist I am the host of this show.

[00:01:14] John Cordray: And so glad that you are tuning in with me today. And so, like I said at the very beginning, we're gonna be talking. Why finding a clinical supervisor as a therapist is so important? Because, I mean, if you're not a therapist, don't tune this out because you need to know this about the therapist that you see because your therapist, or if you're going to try to find a therapist, not only do they have to go through a lot of schooling, but they also have to go through supervision, and it's good for you to know what that process is like.

[00:01:50] John Cordray: So you just know that you're not going in to see someone who just went and studied a bunch of books. It's a lot more than that. And so I want to talk to you [00:02:00] about this mental health company. It's a tech company and I want you to know, Why it's important and why it's here. And so the company is called Motiva.

[00:02:09] John Cordray: Motiva Health is a virtual clinical supervision platform for behavioral health employers. Motiva helps aspiring therapists, social workers, behavioral analysts, and psychologists complete and maintain their licensure through virtual clinical supervision and continuing educat. At my two guests today are CEO and founder Rachel Mccr and Chief Clinical Officer, Dr.

[00:02:34] John Cordray: Carla Smith. Welcome to both of you. 

[00:02:38] Rachel McCrickard: Thanks so much for having us, John. Thanks for 

[00:02:41] John Cordray: having us. Oh, yes. I can't wait to talk about this because this is something that many people probably don't realize is such a need out there. So, Rachel, tell me a little bit first about yourself, your background, why, why are you doing what you're doing?

[00:02:59] John Cordray: And [00:03:00] then Dr. Carla will come and, and I'll say the same thing to. 

[00:03:03] Rachel McCrickard: Great. Yes. Happy to John. First of all, I have to say I didn't notice this when we were planning for the show, but you have such a good radio voice, . I know why people listen to this podcast cause you're very easy to listen to your, Your voice is great for radio.

[00:03:18] Rachel McCrickard: So I just wanted to say that and. Yeah, go 

[00:03:22] John Cordray: ahead. Thank you. I actually was a DJ 

[00:03:24] Rachel McCrickard: for a while. Oh, I mean you come by it naturally. Yes, . Thank you. So, yes, I'm the CEO and founder of, I'm also a licensed marriage and family therapist, and so I really started Motiva to solve a problem that I experienced on my own road to licensure, which was lack of access to clinical supervisor.

[00:03:45] Rachel McCrickard: And I know some of the people that listen to your show might not necessarily be therapists themselves, so I feel like it's important to mention, you know, what is clinical supervision. And it's very similar to residency for a doctor. So new therapists, they [00:04:00] graduate with their master's degree and then they have to work under the professional license of another therapist for about two.

[00:04:08] Rachel McCrickard: Before they're able to be licensed independently themselves. You know the word supervision sometimes sounds like the person's watching you in your counseling sessions, and that's actually not it at all. It's kinda a mentorship or a guide for your licensure journey. So you might see clients, 25 clients a week.

[00:04:27] Rachel McCrickard: You know, doing therapy with your patients and then you have a separate appointment each week with your clinical supervisor to learn skills and, and get better at becoming a therapist. And you need to do that for about two years. So this process of clinical supervision was difficult for me because I'm from a rural area of North Georgia and there weren't any clinical supervisors in my hometown.

[00:04:50] Rachel McCrickard: In fact, the closest one was a two hour drive away. So I was driving each week to Atlanta in order to get to the closest clinical supervisor, [00:05:00] and it's my responsibility to do so and to also pay that supervisor for their time for the hours I needed for licensure. So it was just a long, expensive, arduous process for me.

[00:05:12] Rachel McCrickard: I stuck with it. I got licensed, but then I noticed that state started passing rules saying that you could do supervision remotely through video, video supervision, a virtual supervision. That's what gave me the idea to start Motiva, to really create, you know, a more seamless process for therapists, particularly ones living in rural areas, to find a clinical supervisor and complete these mandatory hours.

[00:05:38] Rachel McCrickard: So that's kind of the impetus behind Motiva, and I'll pass it over to Carla to share her thoughts on why supervision is important to 

[00:05:45] Carla Smith: her. Thanks, Rachel. There's a lot of similarities in the story and the pain points that therapists have, but first I'll tell you a little bit about me. I too am a licensed therapist.

[00:05:55] Carla Smith: I'm a licensed clinical social worker and a licensed marriage and family therapist, [00:06:00] and I worked on both licenses while I was getting my PhD, and so my need and my pain point while living in the Atlanta metro area was not access or geographic location. You know, finding good supervisors, it was supervisors whose values aligned with mine.

[00:06:19] Carla Smith: And, you know, being able to find people who, you know, were openly talking about you know, disproportionate care in mental health and how to create access for people of color to. Quality care. And also doing that while being a PhD student that was working full time and, you know, so not only busy but also didn't have much money.

[00:06:43] Carla Smith: And so I had two people who were absolutely willing to pay it forward and to say like, you know, I wanna work with you, their values aligned and to make it something. Was financially in reach for me who, you know, just kind of [00:07:00] put my needs in front of maybe even, you know, their own, to get a return in what they were giving me.

[00:07:06] Carla Smith: Cuz it was much, you know, what they provided me was valuable. So, you know, my, my connection not only to supervision but also to Motiva is to be able to create that access. You know, Rachel talked about access and I think that equity and work. You know, as a supervisor is to be able to recognize that there are, you know, therapists, there are people that are unable to get, you know, connected to quality supervision, but also supervisors whose, you know, values and maybe even their personal identities or demographic identities align with not only their own, but maybe even their clients and the experience that they'd like and Motiva provided that.

[00:07:49] Carla Smith: For me as a supervisor to be able to pay it forward also and to also meet the needs of my supervises who are looking specifically for me. 

[00:07:58] John Cordray: Well, that's awesome. When [00:08:00] you talked about access and providing access, I've talked a lot about that for individuals trying to find a therapist and, and the access is very limited.

[00:08:10] John Cordray: But what you're saying, you both are saying that there's also a limited access to. Free licensed therapists who are looking and needing a supervisor. That not only is available, but also fits and aligns with their values. And that's so important. And, and Rachel, I I wanna go back to you just for a second.

[00:08:32] John Cordray: You just said two hours, you drove two hours one way to your supervisor. Is that right? Did I hear you right? That's 

[00:08:41] Rachel McCrickard: right, yeah. I mean, luckily I had some really good music to listen to, but yeah, two hours and then two hours back. It was this long process. 

[00:08:50] John Cordray: Wow. And so there you're speaking to practical access, right?

[00:08:55] John Cordray: There just wasn't anyone near you. You had to go way, way away to [00:09:00] find someone and take a huge chunk of your time out of your day just to go see a supervisor. 

[00:09:06] Rachel McCrickard: That's right. And I would say that. That's not limited to just people in rural areas. You know, I did a number of my hours towards licensure in Los Angeles, California as well, and anyone who lives in a major metro area would tell you, even going eight miles can take an hour in Los Angeles.

[00:09:23] Rachel McCrickard: So, You know, this, this hurdle of getting all of the hours that you need is both time consuming. And it's also expensive. And, and Carla already spoke about this a little bit, but you have to pay your supervisor for each hour of supervision. So it can just be a hurdle for people to get started in the profession, really, no matter where they live.

[00:09:43] John Cordray: Yeah, absolutely. And Dr. Carla, the type of access that you were talking about was, is this person a good fit for me as a supervisor? Well, and, and you were, you were talking about referring to culturally responsive supervision. Can you, can you talk a little bit about that and [00:10:00] explain what that means? 

[00:10:01] Carla Smith: Sure.

[00:10:02] Carla Smith: So, you know, culturally responsive care, you know, it actually started in, in schools where we're talking about pedagogy and where that, you know, translates to, to therapy and supervision into the clinical world is that we're meeting people's needs based in what their cultural identities are. And to, to even just identify that access to a person who is responsive.

[00:10:26] Carla Smith: Not just saying like, I'm going to say like, you know, this person is. Black client who grew up in X area, not to know it just in terms of information, but what is it about the services that I provide them that has to be different and responsive to what their needs are coming from that, you know, contextual experience.

[00:10:51] Carla Smith: And so, you know, just like we do have this conversation with our clients, you know, pre-licensed the. Also have needs that are [00:11:00] connected to who they are in their contextual kind of experiences. So their race, their sexual identity, their gender identity, any disabilities. You know, socioeconomic status, these are all things that could be addressed in various ways through supervision.

[00:11:17] Carla Smith: So, you know, my supervisor, I may ask my supervisees, Tell me more about you, you know, culturally, but then also, how do I meet your needs? What are your needs specifically toward, you know, being a ex therapist or ex social worker working on a license. That there are more barriers in blocks based in, you know, certain contextual concerns.

[00:11:44] Carla Smith: So, you know, being able to say, I'm going to address what the needs are, the holistic needs of who this person is in supervision is what culturally responsive supervision 

[00:11:56] John Cordray: is. Well, that's awesome. Thank you. So Rachel, wanna [00:12:00] pass it on to you and tell us what's the typical process of becoming a licensed therapist?

[00:12:08] Rachel McCrickard: Yeah, great question. So, you know, you can't become a licensed therapist with a bachelor's degree, unfortunately. You need to have a master's degree. So usually how people enter the field is they get a master's degree in counseling, psychology, marriage and family therapy, social work, behavior analysis. And then once they complete that, usually anywhere from two to four year degree, they begin the licensure process.

[00:12:31] Rachel McCrickard: They actually start seeing patients in the second year of their grad school program that's called your practicum or your internship. That's where you're just beginning to dip your toe into client work and beginning to learn how to become a therapist. But then once you graduate, you know you've left your university and now you have at least a two year road ahead of.

[00:12:53] Rachel McCrickard: Of honing and developing your skills. So you're usually called an associate level [00:13:00] Therapist is a, is a pretty common term, and you have to work, as I said earlier, under the professional license of another therapist. That other therapist is called your clinical supervisor. So you might work in a behavioral health center, a nonprofit that has a clinical supervisor for you.

[00:13:18] Rachel McCrickard: In some states you might work in private practice, but you have a clinical supervisor over you, and basically what you're not able to do is. Bill commercial insurance, you're able to see patients that are either self pay or who have Medicaid, but you're not able to bill for commercial insurance as a pre-licensed therapist.

[00:13:37] Rachel McCrickard: So you do that for about two years, maybe sometimes longer. You sit for the national licensure exam, you pass that hopefully, and then you get registered with your state and you're a licensed therapist. From there, now you have to get licensed in any state where you. See patients. So if you're licensed in Georgia, you can see patients in Georgia.

[00:13:59] Rachel McCrickard: [00:14:00] There's been some flex around this with the Covid pandemic, but for the most part, you need to be licensed in this state where you are delivering care. 

[00:14:08] John Cordray: Yeah, and I will say the process of becoming a licensed therapist is not an easy one, and this is something that I think people need to hear this because when they are looking for a therapist or maybe they are seeing a therapist, You need to know that the therapists that there are a licensed therapist have gone through many, many steps to get where they're at, which is good for you because you're not talking to just anyone off the street.

[00:14:37] John Cordray: You're talking to someone who has had thorough training, thorough supervision. Yeah. And like you, like you said, they have to pass a national exam to even begin to apply to become licensed in a state. 

[00:14:50] Rachel McCrickard: That's correct. You know the word motiva, we chose it with intention, it means foundation in Portuguese.

[00:14:57] Rachel McCrickard: And the reason we picked that is, you know, very similar to [00:15:00] what Dr. Carlos was saying earlier around culturally responsive care. These are your years to become a clinician, you know, to really hone and develop who you are. And so anyone who's in therapy today, You know, is going to benefit off of that therapist having received culturally responsive quality clinical supervision because it's what makes a therapist a good therapist.

[00:15:25] Rachel McCrickard: It's what gets them ready for the field. It's very important, even in the overall scheme of mental healthcare. 

[00:15:32] John Cordray: Yeah, absolutely. And a good supervisor is going to point out things to grow for a therapist. I just remember long time ago when I had my supervisor, when I was a pre-licensed and I looked forward, I loved meeting with my supervisor because she was so full of experience and knowledge that I didn't really get a lot.

[00:15:57] John Cordray: Not that specific from schooling. [00:16:00] And so I was able to ask about real life situations and, and real life scenarios, and it was so valuable to get. And so I just really valued my time with my supervisor. And then later on, years later, then I then became a supervisor, which is really cool to be able to be the supervisee and then eventually become a supervisor.

[00:16:21] John Cordray: So, Dr. Carla, I've, I've got a question for you. Mm-hmm. . Why is it these days so difficult to find clinical supervision? 

[00:16:32] Carla Smith: That's such a great question and, and you know, there's so many different, you know, experiences that, that do make it difficult. Some of the more general is that, you know, it's an, it's just an overwhelming process.

[00:16:44] Carla Smith: Right? So we're talking about people who, you know, may have just or recently graduated from a clinical program and we're talking about getting licensed, being difficult. Clinical programs are their own, you know, level of difficulty [00:17:00] as you are a graduate student. Yes. Which graduate school is already something that is hard and difficult.

[00:17:06] Carla Smith: By design, being a clinical master student or doc student means that you have an added layer of having to see clients and meet certain requirements there. So you're already kind of leaving this place of overwhelm and meeting requirements and. Having met them and graduated and simply to graduate to another, you know, pretty significant process that has various requirements that we have to meet in certain timeframe and all of those things.

[00:17:37] Carla Smith: So it can be overwhelming. I think also it can be intimidating. So we talked about some of the. Great aspects of being able to work with a seasoned therapist who has also become a supervisor, and speaking to a seasoned therapist who has also become a supervisor can be an intimidating process. Or [00:18:00] if there are, you know, multiple options or not enough options.

[00:18:04] Carla Smith: I think that that's part of the process. We're very vulnerable. Date of having completed something pretty significant, but then also needing to climb another mountain in order to get licensed and to do this, you know, free of having to do supervision. And then the other, the other significant. Thing that makes it difficult at times is that supervisor access and options.

[00:18:28] Carla Smith: So we talked about the, the access. I think also options too, depending on your license type, depending on, you know, the, the populations that you serve or want to serve, and also just. Maybe who you are looking for in a supervisor, it can be difficult to land on, you know, the right person and to say, you know, maybe I met with one or two people and now I don't necessarily think that they're a good fit.

[00:18:56] Carla Smith: But how do I communicate this as a person [00:19:00] with less power or a person who is not sure if I'll be able to find. Someone who is a good fit. And so it's just, it's just a process that has new skills that we, that we have to begin to develop at the same time as having a very important job as being a therapist and showing up in that way for people as 

[00:19:19] John Cordray: well.

[00:19:20] John Cordray: Well, I really like what you said earlier, this is like climbing a mountain and you, you might climb the first mountain only to see the other mountain, Right? So it, I've been on mountains before and I've looked at the summit. If I just get to the summit and I get to where I think the summit is, and it's not really the summit, it's like, Oh, are you kidding me?

[00:19:42] John Cordray: And so it could be really, really tough within this process. And so Rachel, this kinda leads me to my next question. Then how does Motiva make it easier for clinicians to find quality supervisors? Yeah, 

[00:19:59] Rachel McCrickard: I wanna answer that [00:20:00] question. I also wanna just say on the earlier point, I think another thing that makes it difficult is that the field of mental health is constantly changing as well.

[00:20:07] Rachel McCrickard: So it's not just. You know, what did you learn when you were in grad school that's relevant today? I mean, there's, there's constantly, every few years, a different dsm, you know, diagnostic statistical manual of mental disorders that, that guide our work. And you'll need to know what the new diagnosis are like how old diagnosis.

[00:20:29] Rachel McCrickard: Are evolving and, and making more sense or more reflective of what people are experiencing. So I think there's also a moving target here of just because you learn it once doesn't mean you know how to be a good therapist forever. It's really that, you know, ongoing learning piece that's that's important to this process of being a good therapist.

[00:20:47] Rachel McCrickard: So I just wanted to mention that. And then how does Motiva make it easier for clinicians to find supervision? Great question. I mean, we are a marketplace, if you know what a marketplace is, some of the ones you can think of are like Airbnb [00:21:00] or Uber where you, you are seeking a service and there's a lot of.

[00:21:06] Rachel McCrickard: Opportunities out there, but they're not aggregated and placed in one place. So if you think about Airbnb, you're gonna go on vacation to Florida, you don't wanna stay in a hotel, you wanna stay in some sort of house or vacation rental, how would you know what people are available for that? So you go to Airbnb and they've done all that work.

[00:21:24] Rachel McCrickard: They've brought it all together. They've brought the rates together, they've brought the. You know, bells and whistles of everything that you would have at the house. All of that stuff in one place. So that's what Motiva does. We take all of the clinical supervisors that are available and that, that are part of our community, and we say, Here's who they are, here's what they specialize in, here's where they're licensed, here's the rate.

[00:21:48] Rachel McCrickard: Here's who is available. A big part of supervision is you don't just know because they're a supervisor on their website, if they have availability to take on another supervisee, [00:22:00] just like you don't necessarily know, a therapist has availability to take on another client. So bringing all that information to one place is what we've done.

[00:22:10] Rachel McCrickard: And then you can sort and filter a supervisor. That's your state, your license type, you know, either social worker, marriage and family therapist, et cetera. Your specialty. Do they work with children, teens, substance abuse? You know, what are the areas that they are well versed in and finding a supervisor that's ideal for you.

[00:22:32] Rachel McCrickard: Well, that's 

[00:22:32] John Cordray: great, and it brings a question to my mind, how many states is Motiva Health operating? 

[00:22:40] Rachel McCrickard: We're all 50. 

[00:22:41] John Cordray: Yeah. Well, that's fantastic. Yes. So literally, anybody in the US that's listening to this, that they're pre-licensed and they're trying to figure out how am I gonna find a supervisor? Literally they could come to the Motiva and more than likely find a match.

[00:22:57] Rachel McCrickard: Come on, we'd love to have you . 

[00:22:59] John Cordray: I [00:23:00] love it. So, Dr. Carla, I'm gonna pass it off to you. If there is a pre-licensed therapist and they are looking for a supervisor, how do they go about trying to 

[00:23:09] Carla Smith: find one? Yeah, so they, similar to what Rachel just kind of outlined is that they can come to our site, motiva health.com and they can go ahead and do the, the filtering.

[00:23:23] Carla Smith: They can also request to meet with that person and kind of, you know, ask questions that, that they have for the supervisor that they're looking for. You know what we kinda say is like within that conversation between the supervisee and the supervisor, they can both assess whether or not this is a relationship that will fit for what their needs are, what their values are, and all of that can be done on the site.

[00:23:48] Carla Smith: So, It's something that once you go there, you're able to just see a list of people or you know, in many places where there's a need. We can also help with finding a supervisor as [00:24:00] well within that area. So it's self explanatory, but it starts right there on the site. 

[00:24:06] John Cordray: I love that. And the, continue the analogy of mountain climbing, it kinda seems like Motiva is the guide.

[00:24:13] John Cordray: It helps you find the right path to take. I like it. I love using analogies, by the way, . So, okay, so that's how a pre-licensed clinician can go to Motiva Health and sign up for that. What about someone who is thinking and maybe is a supervisor and they're wanting to become a supervisor on Motiva? 

[00:24:37] Carla Smith: Sure they can also join a, a wait list of supervisors and you know, you could actually complete that also on the website and to be placed on the wait list.

[00:24:49] Carla Smith: And then we will, you know, kind of contact you once we have a need in your area. 

[00:24:55] John Cordray: Oh, that's great. So can you say the website again? 

[00:24:59] Carla Smith: Sure. [00:25:00] It's Motiva Health dot. 

[00:25:02] John Cordray: That's easy enough. So whether you are a pre-licensed therapist needing to find a supervisor, or maybe that you are a seasoned therapist and you are ready to be a supervisor and you want to get on the wait list, you go right to the website, follow the instructions, and somebody will contact you.

[00:25:22] John Cordray: It's that easy. It is . I love it. So, What you're saying is that Motiva Health is tackling this issue, this huge mountain, this barrier that's out there, and we talked about lots of different barriers and it's bringing it all together and removing a big part of that, making it so much easier to make that bridge between the pre-licensed therapist with a supervisor.

[00:25:48] John Cordray: And I think that's a great marriage and a great service that Motiva Health is provid. Fantastic. And I wasn't, I mean, we're talking not that long ago that this was not [00:26:00] even possible. Is that right Rachel? 

[00:26:04] Rachel McCrickard: That is right, John. Yeah, I mean, the original idea for Motiva came after I saw that Georgia passed their rule to allow virtual supervision in all settings in 2015.

[00:26:16] Rachel McCrickard: So it was before the pandemic and many states followed suit. They began allowing virtual supervision, but there were some unnecessary restrictions in some states where you had to do half of your hours in person and half could be online, or you had to have your first session in person. But Covid really changed that approach.

[00:26:36] Rachel McCrickard: Therapists learned how to create a virtual office for themselves and oftentimes for their patients as well. And this really extended over to supervision as well. And the value of this for the profession is that therapists are able to get the training that they need from wherever they are, and they're able to.

[00:26:55] Rachel McCrickard: A supervisor that's really based upon their area and [00:27:00] specialty, rather than just the ones that happen to be available in your hometown. So this is really a benefit for the field. Because of this, we're gonna have more licensed clinicians. And we're going to have better trained clinicians. One statistic I wanna point out, John, is that 64% of people who go and get their master's degree in counseling don't ever complete the licensure journey.

[00:27:25] Rachel McCrickard: So at a time where we really need every single mental health therapist launching into to the field, there's a number of people who are, are falling off on this process of getting all of their hours. So this expanded access through virtual supervision is a really important thing. 

[00:27:44] John Cordray: I didn't realize that's, That's the statistics on that.

[00:27:47] John Cordray: That's amazing. That's heartbreaking actually. It 

[00:27:49] Rachel McCrickard: is, isn't it? Yeah, it really isn't. There's a number of reasons for that. It's not just virtual supervision or the clinical supervision process, but it's part of it. 

[00:27:59] John Cordray: And there's like, [00:28:00] we just outlined all the different barriers and hurdles of becoming a therapist, and it is long.

[00:28:06] John Cordray: I remember when I was in grad school, I was working full time and I joined a, an accelerated program in the evenings, and I would go work full time during the day and then go to my evening class for three or four hours for two years. That was a. 

[00:28:23] Rachel McCrickard: Yes. I mean, one thing I'll, I'll point out as well, I made the example earlier of residency for a doctor.

[00:28:30] Rachel McCrickard: A different part about that is that they are still technically in their educational program, so oftentimes they're still, you know, being supported by student loans and they're still part of the process. This happens completely after your education is over, so you've graduated, your student loans are coming due.

[00:28:49] Rachel McCrickard: You know, you are in a very entry level job. And therapists don't make anywhere near as much as doctors do. It's just different. And it is this hurdle that oftentimes [00:29:00] people just aren't able to cross. 

[00:29:02] John Cordray: Yeah. And Motiva Health helps bridge that, that barrier. And I love that. So. Awesome. Well I just have one question for both of you and is the same question, and it's a question that I ask all of my guests that come on the.

[00:29:17] John Cordray: I talk a lot about self care and in our profession we help other people, but sometimes we might neglect ourselves. So it's really important for us as professionals and as individuals to practice self care. So Rachel, I'm gonna ask you, and then Dr. Carla, I'll ask you the same. 

[00:29:39] Rachel McCrickard: Yeah, I love this question, John.

[00:29:41] Rachel McCrickard: I do a couple of things. One, I run every single day. I have a treadmill that I got during Covid and I run on it every single night. And it is, it's the reason Motiva Health exists because if I didn't have that at the end of my day, I think I would carry my stress with me so much. I have a [00:30:00] dog. Make sure that I take her on walks during the day.

[00:30:03] Rachel McCrickard: I make sure I get a really good night of sleep every night. I limit my alcohol intake. You know, I only have a glass or two, you know, a couple of times a week so that I can make sure that my sleep isn't interrupted in any way. And really I think of this as not just caring for myself, but I think it's also caring for my clients and my supervisees because if I'm like not well, I'm not gonna be effective.

[00:30:30] Rachel McCrickard: And so I reframe it in that way as well as this is something I'm doing so that I can give my best performance possible to my. I like 

[00:30:39] John Cordray: that reframing. That is so true. We don't take care of ourselves. How are we going to take care of our clients? Yeah, I like it. All right, Dr. Carla, you're up. What are you doing for self?

[00:30:49] Carla Smith: Sure. So, you know, I think of, I think of myself now very differently as what I did for self-care as a, you know, pre-licensed clinician, just in terms of [00:31:00] access. So, you know, I just think across the board, being able to connect to things that, whether they're free or paid, that you know is within budget, that really does help.

[00:31:11] Carla Smith: One of the things is therapy. That's first and foremost. And you know, as a pre-licensed therapist, I couldn't afford to go to therapy, and while supervision is not a standin for therapy, there were times where my supervisor was kind of like a, another set of eyes on me and she would say, Hey, here's some options for some low cost supervision, or Here's a group for you.

[00:31:32] Carla Smith: So, you know, there's a difference in what I can do about that, but I think therapy is really important and really taking care of our mental and emotional wellbeing is important. The other is that I am super into TV and I have no shame about that. I will watch tv, you know, when the, the need strikes.

[00:31:50] Carla Smith: There are times where I'm even working, where I have new girl on in the background, and I'm okay with. And then the last is that I do yoga and I am [00:32:00] also a like lifelong student. So, you know, the way that I actually hold myself accountable is that I am also in a yoga teacher training course. And so, you know, like I make sure that I have my little schedule that on the weekends I, I do just because I'm just so used to working.

[00:32:16] Carla Smith: And so instead of doing work on the weekends, I do my yoga teacher work. And so, Kind of does this, this double work of taking care of me, but then also making sure that I am holding myself accountable to it. 

[00:32:29] John Cordray: Oh, I like that. So I think we all can agree that self-care is so critical and it's not just something that we talk about.

[00:32:38] John Cordray: It's something that we do, something that we live. I love asking my, my guests that because it encourages all of us that we need to continue to work on our self. Well, I wanna thank you both for coming on the show and talking about a very, very important topic and love to hear more [00:33:00] about Motiva Health, and I'm sure we'll continue this relationship.

[00:33:04] John Cordray: But thank you so much for explaining what y'all do. Thank you so much for coming on the show. 

[00:33:09] Rachel McCrickard: Thank you so much for having us, John. Thanks for having 

[00:33:12] John Cordray: us, John. Oh, you're welcome. My pleasure. It's an honor to have you both on, and it's an honor of mine. For all of you who are listening to the show, some of you are new to the show.

[00:33:22] John Cordray: Some of you have been listening for many years, and I really appreciate that. I appreciate. I hope this has encouraged you to continue to work on your mental health. I hope it's encouraged you to realize that your therapist, if you go see one, had a lot of training and a lot of great supervision, so important.

[00:33:41] John Cordray: Well continue to work on your mental health, and as always, I want you to know that the Mental Health Today Show has been championing your mental health since 2015. Take.[00:34:00] 

Rachel McCrickard Profile Photo

Rachel McCrickard

CEO / Founder

Rachel McCrickard is the CEO and Founder of Motivo, the largest virtual clinical supervision platform. Motivo connects aspiring therapists and organizations to virtual clinical supervisors to complete the licensure process. A Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist herself, Rachel created Motivo in 2018 out of frustration from the two-hour drive back and forth to meet the closest clinical supervisor during her own licensure journey. Rachel lives in Richmond, VA with her husband, Warren and their adorable pup, Lucy.

Carla Smith Profile Photo

Carla Smith

Chief Clinical Officer/Licensed Therapist/Mommy

Dr. Carla Smith (she/her) works at the intersections of mental health and social justice. A licensed therapist (LCSW, LMFT) and trained DEIB (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging) Coach, she creates opportunities for health equity by focusing on training, inclusion, and emotion work. Dr. Carla is the Chief Clinical Officer at Motivo, an online platform for clinical supervision. She is also the Founder and CEO of Haven Therapy of Atlanta, a mental health practice serving people throughout Georgia. Both roles give Dr. Carla the opportunity to create systemic change for people deeply impacted by sociohistorical trauma, particularly Queer BIPOC (Black/Brown, Indigenous, People of Color). She uses her professional and social media platforms to bring attention to forms of oppression that contribute to social inequities, risk individual autonomy, and harm relationships.

Dr. Carla has earned a Doctorate in Human Development and Family Science, with a specialization in MFT from the University of Georgia; a Master of Social Work degree, also from UGA; and a Bachelor of Arts degree in English Literature from Rutgers University. She completed DEI training with the Social Justice Training Institute and has been providing DEI solutions to healthcare organizations for over 10 years. Her research and training are in the areas of identity development, the intergenerational transmission of cultural identity, and providing quality, culturally responsive, affirming clinical services to socially marginalized people. Dr. Carla seeks to disrupt the ways we provide clinical training in healthcare to teach providers to lead with cultural humility.