Oct. 3, 2022

From Living With Social Anxiety to Becoming A Certified Nutrition Coach With Mark Metry

From Living With Social Anxiety to Becoming A Certified Nutrition Coach With Mark Metry

From Living With Social Anxiety to Becoming A Certified Nutrition Coach With Mark Metry

Mark has been featured in over 250 podcasts and media like Forbes magazine, Mindvalley, Influencive, Inc Magazine, Huff Post, Fearless Motivation, and Spartan. 

His podcast, Humans 2.0 (now The Mark Metry Show) has received over 75 Million views. 

Mark’s podcast hit #96 of the top podcasts in the world along with Tim Ferriss, NPR, Lewis Howes & Gary Vaynerchuk.

Mark was recently chosen as LinkedIn’s Top 10 Voice in Mental Health with over 100,000 followers, he is a 2x TEDx Speaker, and he is a coach and best-selling author of “Screw Being Shy”.

Your diet affects your mental health. As your brain absorbs nutrients in your body, the source of these nutrients matters most. It’s best to maintain a healthy lifestyle based on what you eat.  

Certified nutrition coach and best-selling author Mark Metry explains how the food you eat affects the inner workings of your brain. His extensive knowledge of the connection between food and mental health is based on his personal experience in overcoming his anxiety, depression, and struggles by improving his diet and changing his routine. A significant change always begins with the first step. 

Mark hosts his own podcast, The Mark Metry Show, which has earned 75 million views. He is the author of the best-selling book, Screw Being Shy. With his massive influence on social media, he has made it to the Top 10 Voice in Mental Health on LinkedIn. As a nutrition coach, he helps his clients implement routines and maintain diet plans that help them achieve a healthier lifestyle. 


[0:00] Introduction
[02:30] Mark Metry’s social anxiety stems from his childhood. 
[05:30] Mark launched his own podcast to help him cope with mental health struggles
[08:03] What are Mark’s defining moments?
[13:45] Cognitive distortions will influence your perceptions. 
[16:18] What is the cognitive bias codex?
[17:25] Mark tried out all kinds of diets. 
[18:40] Nutritional psychology is a branch of science that connects diet and mental health. 
[23:28] John explains the five important things to maintain a healthy lifestyle. 
[24:31] What is a certified nutrition coach?
[27:01] Mark shares his self-care routine. 
[30:15] John shares his self-care routine. 

Connect with Mark Metry: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mark-metry/
Visit his official website:

Rate the show: If you enjoyed this episode, please consider providing an honest rating of the show here www.mentalhealthtodayshow.com/reviews/new . Your review will really help the show reach more people - thank you! 

Learn more about John Cordray at www.johncordray.com 

Disclaimer: The Mental Health Today Show is for educational purposes only and should not be interpreted as therapy. If you are seeking therapy, please contact a licensed therapist for help.

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[00:00:00] John Cordray: If you have experienced social anxiety in your life, you may not realize that there is a connection between anxiety or really mental health in general, with the food that we eat. And one of the things that I talk to my clients all the time is having and developing a healthy nutrition is so vital to their mental health.

[00:00:21] John Cordray: So today we're gonna be talking about social anxiety, making that connection with Nutri. So the title of this episode is from living with social anxiety, to becoming a certified nutrition coach with mark Metri. Very excited for this stay tuned right after this. 

[00:00:39] John Cordray: Welcome back to the mental health today. Show my name is John Cordray. I am a licensed therapist in the host of this. And today I am delighted to bring to you a very special guest. His name is mark Metri. And let me just tell you a little bit about his amazing bio. So mark has been featured in over 250 podcast in [00:01:00] media, like Forbes magazine, mid valley influence of ink magazine, H Huff posts, fearless motivation and Spartan.

[00:01:08] John Cordray: He actually has a podcast and is called the mark mentor show. And he has received over 75 million views. Amazing Mark's podcast hit number 96 of top podcast in the world with Tim Ferris, NPR Lewis house and Gary Vayner. Chuck Gary V. Mark mark was recently chosen as LinkedIn's top 10 voice in mental health with over, get this over a hundred thousand followers on LinkedIn.

[00:01:39] John Cordray: He is a two time TEDx speaker and he is a coach and best selling author of screw being shy. Mark, welcome to the show. 

[00:01:50] Mark Metry: What an intro, John, thank you so much for having me. I appreciate you. How 

[00:01:53] John Cordray: are you? I'm doing wonderful. I appreciate you asking well, okay. [00:02:00] So I wanna get right into this. The title has social anxiety in it and you're not a therapist yourself.

[00:02:07] John Cordray: Is that correct? That's correct 

[00:02:09] Mark Metry: to no medical license. Okay. 

[00:02:12] John Cordray: So tell me a little bit then, did you ever experience social anxiety in your life? 

[00:02:18] Mark Metry: Yeah, you know, I was that kid growing up who like didn't have any friends who often sat in the back of the classroom and I live like that for like almost a decade of my life growing up.

[00:02:33] Mark Metry: And it wasn't until I was about 18 years old where I went off to college. And I subsequently started to face like different issues, like different physical health problems. I started to like face like really severe depression. I started to face insomnia. I couldn't go to sleep at night. Couldn't wake up in the morning and like my lifelong social anxiety that I always had.

[00:02:55] Mark Metry: Really just like transformed into like social isolation. I like just kind of stopped talking to my [00:03:00] family, my friends, and you know, life became very dark and I kind of reached this level of rock bottom in my life where I just, I literally had no idea like what to do with my life. Like life just became like so painful and so unbearable that, you know, eventually like in 2015, I got to a point where I was like contemplating suicide.

[00:03:21] Mark Metry: And then I, it was like a whole story. And I would go for walks at nighttime at like 3:00 AM. And ultimately it was me experiencing that, that really kind of shocked my system and really began to sort of get me to understand that I need help. And there's gotta be just a different way to operate in life.

[00:03:42] Mark Metry: Like there's gotta be a different. Like manual for my brain that I need to learn. And so like, after those years, like, you know, month after month, year after year, I started to become healthier. I went to therapy. I started to read different books. I started to learn. [00:04:00] How to eat healthy. I started to meditate.

[00:04:02] Mark Metry: I started to do all these different habits that we all know. And eventually that got me to the spot where in 2020, like literally right before COVID shut down everything. I was like, I gotta write a book. I gotta talk about this because I was like a big speaker in like the whole like marketing entrepreneurial industry.

[00:04:21] Mark Metry: And like, what I noticed was that at the end of all my talks. There would always be at least like one person in every single city that I visited and I spoke at and they would like, wait for me to, to be done talking at the end of the event as I was leaving. And they would walk up to me and, and I could tell they definitely, you know, had some degree of social anxiety, just like I did.

[00:04:44] Mark Metry: And they'd ask me the same question. They they'd say, Hey mark, how did you go from someone who didn't have any friends was always shy, was always socially anxious, their entire. To like being able to be a speaker and be confident and have energy and, and do the things that you want to do. And that just kept on [00:05:00] happening to me so often.

[00:05:01] Mark Metry: Like I've gotta talk about this and that's really where I would say like my passion for, for mental health and kind of understanding like how I helped myself over the years really just started to compound. And like on top of that, I also ended up starting a podcast in that process where. You know, it led me to interviewing over like 300 people.

[00:05:21] Mark Metry: Some of these people are, are doctors, therapists, psychologists, neuroscientists, people from all different, like fields of, of life, all kind of relating towards mental health that, you know, and, and plus like I'm a pretty young guy. And so I just started to kind of realize, like, I've gotta talk about this stuff because I almost feel like I have a responsibility to my position.

[00:05:42] Mark Metry: Just like for other people, you know? And I'm always trying to learn like this year I'm, I'm like in the process of getting my certification for becoming a nutrition coach, because I honestly like just what I've seen over, like the last several years, like, and then just for me and myself and my skill and what I'm [00:06:00] interested in.

[00:06:00] Mark Metry: Like, I honestly think that mental health is like such a complicated subject. you know, and a lot of times, like people don't know where to start. And after all these years, and after looking at my own experience, I've come to learn that like nutrition, just like the simple act of having someone to like focus truly on like what they're eating that can change someone's entire life that literally can create a compound effect that can lead them to making small change over small change, over small change every day.

[00:06:32] Mark Metry: And when I look back to my story, like in 2015, when I had no idea what mental health was, I had no idea what anxiety was and yet it was what I was facing every day. And I was like overweight. I was obese at the time. And literally the one thing for me that I just started doing was like, I gotta eat healthy.

[00:06:48] Mark Metry: And I started to learn, and that kind of set a, a chain reaction that kind of led me to where I am today. And so I've just tried to like, take my, my story and my experiences. And I'm trying to put them in a way [00:07:00] where. I can help other people and, and people can look at my journey and, you know, not necessarily model it, but you know, it's, it's been a crazy journey.

[00:07:10] Mark Metry: at least thanks for listening, John. Yeah. 

[00:07:13] John Cordray: well, just amazing to listen to all of that in all the, the experience that you have been able to do. And as you were talking, I was wondering if there was a time in, in your life that, and I call 'em defining moments. Was there a defining moment when it clicked for you that yeah.

[00:07:34] John Cordray: You had the social anxiety, it had a lot of control over you. You were obese, you were withdrawing from people, but was there a defining moment that it just clicked for? You said something's gotta change and this is what I need to do. 

[00:07:49] Mark Metry: Yeah. You know, and, and when I look back at it, there were like many, many moments like that.

[00:07:55] Mark Metry: And, and like, one of them that comes to mind is that, so when I was suicidal, like one [00:08:00] of the things that I did was in the place that I was living in Boston at the time, there was like a neighboring city that, you know, definitely like had its problems, had a lot of crime, had a lot of like gang violence.

[00:08:12] Mark Metry: And I remember what I would do is like, I would go for, for walks at night. In those areas. And I would just like, hope that, well, like someone would try to walk up to me and kill me. And I remember on one of those nights when I was walking, you know, something just sort of clicked in me where I was sort of walking and I was looking down and my brain was sort of like running this automatic script that I didn't really know it was happening at the time, but it was just sort of these underlying thoughts that were telling me.

[00:08:42] Mark Metry: You know, like, oh, I wanna do this, but then, oh, no, I can't do that because you know, someone like me can't do this. Or, you know, I guess I'm gonna be stuck like this forever, or, you know, no matter how much I try, I can never get out of this. And I had all like these repeating [00:09:00] thoughts in my head and on one of these nights where I was walking, I don't really know what happened.

[00:09:05] Mark Metry: I've had other people try to explain it to me. On one of these nights where I'm walking, I just like, sort of gained a moment of clarity where I was like, wait, these things that I'm feeling, this is like information that my own brain is telling me. And like, when I had like that very small realization, that was like the beginning of me sort of understanding a new paradigm of life, which is basically.

[00:09:33] Mark Metry: You know, a lot of people, I think, especially in this case, you know, especially that haven't been taught a lot about mental health. A lot of the times, like, you know, when you look at social anxiety, it's like, what is social anxiety caused by obviously depends on the person. But social anxiety is basically caused by, you know, bullying, discrimination being picked on looking different compared to anybody else.

[00:09:56] Mark Metry: So a lot of it is based on like past trauma. There's [00:10:00] also like different brain factors. . And so a lot of people like me living in this situation, you wake up every day and like your brain is constantly telling you this information. Every time you walk into a public scenario, a social setting, your brain is like flooding you with this information that is basically freezing, like your own sense of like free will to decide and do what you want.

[00:10:24] Mark Metry: And I think like the first step of that is understanding that this is all happening inside of your. I don't mean to like, be dismissive and tell someone like, oh, this is all inside of your head or anything like that. I'm not saying that. But what I am saying is that based on how your brain captured the past, your brain is then repeating the past to yourself.

[00:10:46] Mark Metry: And if you don't understand that, like your brain is like the set of glasses in which you perceive the world through, and it's sending you information, then like you're gonna live your life and you're gonna live your life from this perspective. [00:11:00] You're never gonna have any sense of control. Like it's always gonna be the outside world that is controlling you and you have no ability to change it.

[00:11:07] Mark Metry: And for me, when I realized that, oh, I have this concept of like a brain, that's sending me information. So if I have this brain and I can change this brain, then it can change and give me different information, which can change the quality of my life and what I think about myself and what I believe about.

[00:11:27] Mark Metry: And so like, when I experienced like that small realization on like that night, I specifically remember just like feeling an overwhelm of like emotion. And I remember just like running home and I remember running home and going to my apartment and getting in the door and going to the bathroom. And I remember looking at myself in the bathroom mirror and just like slowly starting to realize that, you know, like the last like three months or so at that time.

[00:11:56] Mark Metry: That's really where, where my mental health kind of like really deteriorated. [00:12:00] I got depressed over like a three month period. I gained something like 75 pounds over like a three month period. And so when I looked at myself in the mirror, I kind just kind of had this moment of like clarity of just like mark, like you're in this position right now in your life.

[00:12:14] Mark Metry: I don't even know how I got here, but like, this is the situation. And let me just like focus on things one by one, you know? And, and I remember that was a moment. And then for example, in another moment that I remember. Is that I remember, you know, starting to understand a little bit about like food. And I remember, you know, changing my diet and I remember I lost all the weight and I remember having this moment where, you know, I was in college at the time and this was like right at the start of the year.

[00:12:41] Mark Metry: So I remember like getting to like the first day of college, like the second year, and like looking at myself in the mirror, it wasn't the same mirror, but in this sort of a similar way, I looked at myself in the mirror and I was like, wow, like I made a decision to say, Hey, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna get healthier.

[00:12:58] Mark Metry: I'm gonna lose weight. I [00:13:00] looked at my body and I was like, mark, you did it like you did the goal. And I remember that for me was also a very defining moment because that for me was like the first reinforcement of like change of like, oh wow. I actually can change my life. And it was like a great moment of like great positive feedback loop that I think set up for a lot of other, you know, healthy habits that I formed.

[00:13:22] Mark Metry: And so those two moments come to mind, John. Oh, that's 

[00:13:25] John Cordray: great. Fantastic. And when you were talking about having those negative thoughts, we call those in the counseling world, cognitive distortions, and a cognitive distortion is something that you think is true, but it's not really true and influences how you feel and then ultimately how you behave.

[00:13:45] John Cordray: And so if you feel, or if you, if your cognitive distortion is focused on, I'm no good. I'm a failure. The world is coming to an end. If you focus on that, then it influences how you feel, [00:14:00] and then it might feel a lot of anxiety. So when you have a cognitive distortion with social anxiety, for instance, we call mind reading and you just know you're going to make a fool of yourself and embarrass yourself.

[00:14:13] John Cordray: And everybody's gonna look at you and, and make fun of you. And then that creates the anxiety. The behavior is I'm not going to put myself in that position again. And so I'm going to withdraw, or I'm never going to be in a social situation again. And so what you described very eloquently is that you had multiple cognitive distortions for a long time, but there was moments in your life where you realized, and you may have not have been able to say, oh, I'm having a cognitive distort.

[00:14:45] John Cordray: But there was times in your life where it was defining in a fact that you were confronting those cognitive distortions. So instead of telling yourself or thinking to yourself, well, [00:15:00] what if, and then automatically assuming worst, what if something bad happens? There was a time when you switched it to what if something good happens?

[00:15:11] John Cordray: Just like when you said you looked at yourself in the mirror and it was like, well, what if, what if I started eating healthy? What if, if I start to work at and learn more about mental health and you, you went from, from those cognitive distortions and have them manage you to you managing those feelings, you just really define it really.

[00:15:36] John Cordray: And I'm really interested in learning a little bit more about when you made that decision to start eating healthy and the nutrition and how that piece came into your life. You're pursuing being a certified nutrition coach. Really interesting to see how that came about and kind of what your goals are with that.

[00:15:58] Mark Metry: Yeah. So [00:16:00] first off, thank you so much for telling about. Like the cognitive distortion and like something that really completely changed. The way that I look at life is when I saw this thing called a I think it's called a cognitive bias codex. I think you might have seen it. And it's basically like this whole chart and it like literally shows you all these different, like cognitive biases and cognitive distortions and like these different like rules really that your brain has created to assume.

[00:16:27] Mark Metry: Reality based on a limited amount of information. And it really is like mind blowing when you see it all laid out like that. So like thank you for mentioning that. I totally forgot to, to mention that that was like also a key piece and something that really changed for me. So for me, When I first started to be like, Hey, I wanna lose weight.

[00:16:48] Mark Metry: I want to be healthy. It was simple. But at the same time, it was also like one of the most confusing things that I ever did. And I remember like going on Google and like typing in like [00:17:00] what's the best diet to eat. And then just like literally seeing like 1200 different, you know, results. And I remember experimenting with different things.

[00:17:08] Mark Metry: I experimented on like a, on like a vegan diet. I experimented. All different kinds of diets. And I honestly, like I made different mistakes. along my journey. I, you know, fell trapped into some different forms of misinformation around nutrition. And like, what I learned was that this is like one of the biggest obstacles that stopping people.

[00:17:32] Mark Metry: Because a lot of the times, like if you do what I did, you search, what kind of diet you're gonna like fall down all these different rabbit holes. and a lot of the times, you know, there isn't such thing as like a one universal, healthy diet that works for everyone. And at the same time, it's like all these different choices, all these different pieces of information that says, oh no, eat this.

[00:17:52] Mark Metry: Don't eat that, eat it at this time. Or no, eat it. Only eat once a meal, eat five times a day. There's so many different things out there where I think a [00:18:00] lot of people they're just like, Hey, I'm just gonna like, keep eating whatever I'm doing, because all this information. It's very confusing and very exhausting, you know?

[00:18:09] Mark Metry: And so I definitely fell down that rabbit hole, but for me, like the real passion, and I think the real power of nutrition is like, there's like a unfolding field of study called nutritional psychiatry. And like, for example, I've had a few different people on my podcast. One of 'em by the name of Dr. Drew Ramsey, where like, there really is like an emerging field of science called nutritional psychiatry and essentially the idea behind it.

[00:18:37] Mark Metry: Is that our brain is what consumes a lot of like different nutrients and proteins and fats and carbohydrates that we eat on a regular basis. Like our brain is very, very fuel intensive. It requires fuel, and it's very picky about it as well. And so basically nutritional psychiatry is this idea that scientists have sort of like [00:19:00] distilled down.

[00:19:01] Mark Metry: There's like a handful of different nutrients, different like compound. Your body basically like needs to eat through food in order to ensure like maximum brain function. Now, does this mean like, oh, if, if you eat a salad, like your depression is gonna go away. No, that's not what I'm saying. And also at the same time, it's like, Hey, if you eat ice cream, all of a sudden, that's not gonna give you anxiety, you know?

[00:19:23] Mark Metry: And so not to play on like either extreme here, but this idea of nutritional psychiatry, it really is so powerful and it's especially powerful because. People actually see very quick results with it. If they can find a plan and find guidance that works for their lifestyle. And so like, for example, for me, when I was sort of like following like a nutritional, a sort of a brain healthy diet, I remember within like two weeks, like all of a sudden, you know, like feeling like I have like maybe 5%, [00:20:00] 10% more.

[00:20:01] Mark Metry: And then all of a sudden it's like, Hey, I have 10% energy now. Like going outside for like a walk is not that strenuous. So then I would like go outside for a walk and I continuously eat healthy. And then I realized like, oh, Hey, actually, like my digestion is actually much better. You know? So then now I have even more energy and then it's like, Hey, now I've, you know, I've got energy.

[00:20:24] Mark Metry: My digestion is working well. I've got a little bit more energy to go outside and go for a walk. Now, all of a sudden, like I notice I'm like sleeping 10% better. Like now someone, for example, for me, who's had like sleeping problems, their entire life. It's like a little bit easier. And then now you're sleeping like 10% better.

[00:20:44] Mark Metry: Now you're waking up with even more energy. And then what happens is like you, you sit down to work or let's say you sit down to read a book or you sit down to try to meditate. And then now your focus is actually like 20%. because like a lot of people don't know so much of your focus [00:21:00] has to do with the state of your brain health, which is often overlooked and neglect.

[00:21:06] Mark Metry: so all of a sudden you have like all these compound effects that are happening, that just make everything else easier and makes, you know, showing up to appointments easier. It makes you have like that 10% ability to be a little bit more confident, which then, you know, starts to give you the energy, to do the things that are gonna make someone confident.

[00:21:26] Mark Metry: And it starts like this entire chain reaction. And it really comes from like a very simple principle. Just trying to eat a brain healthy diet that fits your lifestyle. It's, you know, a lot of people don't make that connection of like eating certain foods with your mental health or a lot of the times people sort of dismiss this as like, oh yeah, you've just gotta exercise and eat healthy.

[00:21:49] Mark Metry: And there's so many different myths around food of, oh, eat this kind of food. Don't eat this kind of food that I think has just confused. So many people alongside. [00:22:00] Like the multibillion dollar health and wellness industry that basically like comes up with a new diet every year to confuse people. And then there's different people out there who also have like eating disorders that, you know, have really been like used.

[00:22:16] Mark Metry: By food marketing companies and have really like twisted their psychology. It's very sad to see how like people have been led down a path to saying, oh, oh, you know, the only way to be healthy is to eat salads and, and to eat celery with peanut butter and to starve yourself. And it it's just so sad to see.

[00:22:37] Mark Metry: Just different things that like the industry has done to make money and take advantage over people. And I hope that like over the coming years, like I can come into this space, especially with like this angle with anxiety and brain health, to like really change the way that people like think and look about food in general on how it can affect their brain and their mind.

[00:22:58] John Cordray: The hundred percent I [00:23:00] preach that a lot. With my clients and I call it the, my big five. I have five things that are little things, minor things that could be hard to do, but they're not huge. They're not rocket science and the five things. My big five eat a healthy diet. Number one, number two, drink, plenty of water.

[00:23:23] John Cordray: Number three, get plenty of rest. Four exercise and five. Be social. and the big five, those little increments and what you said earlier, spot on making small, minor steps, even if it's 1%, 5%, 10%, because that is going in the right direction. And I call those micro wins. And when you can win on small little increments that builds your confidence and over time as your confidence rises, and you've said, Then [00:24:00] you're, you're at a level where you can really start making traction with your mental health.

[00:24:06] Mark Metry: Boom. I'm glad you do what you do. 

[00:24:11] John Cordray: yeah. Yeah. I I've been doing this for a little while, but here's what I'm wondering. If, can you tell us a little bit about what exactly is a certified nutrition coach? Yeah. 

[00:24:23] Mark Metry: So, for example, someone like you, who's a therapist, or maybe even someone who's a doctor, right? A lot of the times like, yeah, everyone advises their patients, their clients to eat healthy, but the truth is it's, it's very complicated.

[00:24:35] Mark Metry: It may not be complicated for some people, but in terms of like actually implementing the lifestyle changes while also knowing like accurate information. Basically a nutrition coach, coaches, someone on how to actually implement all like these little steps in terms of nutrition, into like their diet, into their lifestyle, both from like a, like an [00:25:00] information standpoint of like, Hey, you know, based on the information you told me, like, you know, you should probably be eating this.

[00:25:06] Mark Metry: Maybe even like, you know, helping them take certain supplements, helping them figure out different myths that they maybe believe. And then also, you know, helping them reinforce that behavior change. So it's kind of like the actual application of how someone can do it. And like, I don't know about you, but like, I think this is probably like the most aside from therapists, this is probably like the most like needed, I think profession in America, because like, there's so many doctors, psychologists, therapists, you know, so many people who tell their clients and patients to eat healthy and maybe they even tell them what to eat, but.

[00:25:42] Mark Metry: The difference between actually applying that is a completely different skill set. That honestly is almost impossible for the average person to just figure out on their own because of like modern food because of marketing, it has made it [00:26:00] like so psychologically confusing for people. So people like me, we study it and we study the industry.

[00:26:07] Mark Metry: We study the science, the studies. Trying to stay up to date on those and then just try to help them master and connect that behavior change into their nutrition lifestyle every day. I 

[00:26:20] John Cordray: love it. And coming from somebody who has experienced social anxiety, depression makes it even more impactful because you're not just talking about knowledge.

[00:26:32] John Cordray: You're talking about lifestyle. I mean, you, you lived it. And so that brings a whole nother level. To what you offer people. So amazing. Well, mark keeping an eye our time here. And one of the things I like to ask my guests towards the end of the episode, I, I talk a lot about selfcare and the importance of self care.

[00:26:55] John Cordray: And I would love to know what are some things that you do for care? [00:27:00] 

[00:27:01] Mark Metry: John, my entire life is self care. Okay. . No, but I, I do so many different things and like some of my favorite things for example, are, you know, like I love cooking. I love putting on some music, maybe like inviting some of my friends or cooking for my friends or my family.

[00:27:18] Mark Metry: And just like having like a great, like social time while involving like cooking and food. It's like a very beautiful process. And I think a lot of the times too, like when you study like the development of like humans and, and whatnot, like so much of our social. Was when we were eating together, you know, and I think that's like a huge piece that a lot of us are missing today.

[00:27:41] Mark Metry: And, and there's obviously there's different factors that we can and can't control, but that's a big one. Another one too, is like, I really enjoy making music. And this is something that I kind of, like, I always had it internally deep within me. Really started to like come out in like [00:28:00] 2018 as I started to like, know who I am more.

[00:28:03] Mark Metry: And as I started to heal more and really just kind of fix my mind, I just started to like write music. And that has been like one of the most powerful and like expressive things that I do honestly all the time. Like, I feel like I, I think in music, like the way that I feel and think through. Is through music.

[00:28:23] Mark Metry: And a lot of the times, like, you know, and I journal too, but like the same ways that, you know, people will journal, I'll often journal, but I'll do it in the forms of like making songs , you know? And so it's very, very powerful technique, especially because, you know, I believe that music is like one of the most powerful forces on earth.

[00:28:45] Mark Metry: Like I believe that music. Can really, really help people's minds. And, and there's also like a scientific mathematical framework too, of like looking at how your ear like interprets different like musical sounding notes, and then [00:29:00] how your brain response to it. It's like a whole science is very, very interesting.

[00:29:05] Mark Metry: And so that's, that's another one. Another one too, is like, like sometimes what I'll do is like, if I'm just like going on a walk or I'll just catch myself and I'll have free time. Honestly, what I'll do is I'll just go to my phone. I'll just like quickly, like scroll through my texts. And I'll just like find someone who I haven't talked to in a while and I'll just like call them.

[00:29:24] Mark Metry: And a lot of times they don't respond. It's like 3:00 PM. They're like in the middle of a meeting, but sometimes like random people do respond and it's just like a great way for me to just like, always make sure that like I'm staying connected and I'm being social. And I'm just like checking up on other people because I think that's very, very important, you know?

[00:29:42] Mark Metry: And I. Doing that also helps me too. What about you? What do you do for selfcare? Oh, wow. 

[00:29:50] John Cordray: I've never had a guest ask me that on here. This is great way to turn it back on me. Yeah. So self-care is totally important to me. [00:30:00] Absolutely. You know, my line of work day in and day out, I'm really meeting someone at their lowest point in their life and they're revealing to me.

[00:30:10] John Cordray: Their struggle. And sometimes their struggle can be very heavy. So as therapist, it is important for us to practice what we preach. So what I do, everything outdoors, everything outside love the outdoors. And one of the, my favorite things to do is go trail, riding bike, riding on trails with my wife in.

[00:30:33] John Cordray: In a little bit here, we're gonna go trail riding and I cannot wait. I love doing that. I love hiking. I love just doing anything in nature. And I also really enjoy urban doing things in urban. So here in St. Louis, we have a large park it's called forest park. It's actually larger than central. And there are all kinds of things to do there.

[00:30:57] John Cordray: And in the summertime we go to [00:31:00] a play it's an outdoor amphitheater called the muni. So we go and watch live musical Broadway musicals during the summer. Love it just absolutely love it. So thank you for asking me. I like listening to music. I don't make music, but I love and I like to cook as well. I look at myself as more of a sous chef than a chef.

[00:31:23] John Cordray: I. Chop up, whatever my wife tells me to chop up and I do it . So what's like your favorite thing? Like a, oh my goodness. Wow. One of my favorites, it's a Mediterranean dish and we get all fresh, like fresh peppers. I chop peppers and onions. We have the sauce that we make and then we have chicken thigh. And then we let it broil and then we bring it out of the oven.

[00:31:52] John Cordray: And then we put in olives and fed a cheese and is the most amazing texture and taste that [00:32:00] you'll ever taste in your life. Love it, pair it with a nice glass of wine. It's amazing. So that's definitely one of my favorites. 

[00:32:08] Mark Metry: that's awesome. Yeah. You, you need a good meal for your taste buds and for your brain.

[00:32:12] Mark Metry: Yes, 

[00:32:13] John Cordray: absolutely. Completely agree. Well, I wanted to thank you again for coming on my show, but I also, before we leave, people are listening to you and they maybe are experiencing some anxiety or depression themselves. And maybe what you said was really, really impactful for them. And maybe they're curious, is there a way that someone, if they wanted to reach out to you, like, do you have a website or social media that would be great for someone to, to reach out to.

[00:32:44] John Cordray: No man. I'm 

[00:32:44] Mark Metry: actually not on the internet. No, I'm just kidding. imagine that. No, no. I'm I'm everywhere. I got a website. It's just my first and last name.com. M a R K M E R Y. Dot com. I have an Instagram. It's my first and [00:33:00] last name. I've got a LinkedIn, my first and last name. What else do I got? I've got a TikTok.

[00:33:05] Mark Metry: I don't really use it though. And that's it? Yeah. You know, I've got a, I've got a book. People can check out. It's called screw being shy. It's not Amazon. It's also an audio book as well. And yeah. Feel free to reach out. Happy to help anyone answer any questions, John, I appreciate you. This was a blast. Thank you for making my Wednesday night.

[00:33:25] Mark Metry: Oh, 

[00:33:25] John Cordray: you're you're absolutely welcome. so my pleasure, always my pleasure. So I wanted to just thank my listeners. I know some of you are brand new. Some of you have been around for years, and I just really appreciate you. You are the reason why I have this show and I hope you find value. And especially this episode with mark, I hope it's been helpful for you.

[00:33:51] John Cordray: And I know that you're taking care of yourself and that's one of the things I keep talking about is for you to keep working on your mental health. And so I want this show to be [00:34:00] encouraging to you. So I really appreciate you. And the mental health today show has been championing your mental health since 2015.

[00:34:10] John Cordray: Keep working, keep plugging away and take care of yourself.